Hermit
fuddle
I guess I'm at a loss as to what a wiring primer would include. I guess you have to lay out the areas that you don't understand and need elaborated on. Once you know the electrical part then wiring is just the physical aspect.
The sections relating to panels are very short.
This may have been brought up, but if one were to follow code/industry standards in building their control panel, wouldn't the proper codes/standards be: NEC Article 409 (Industrial Control Panels) and UL508A (Standard for Industrial Control Panels). NEC Article 300.1(B) leads me to believe that Article 300 would not apply to the internals of the control panel.
Here's a post I had in reference to codes for control panels:
I guess I'm at a loss as to what a wiring primer would include. I guess you have to lay out the areas that you don't understand and need elaborated on. Once you know the electrical part then wiring is just the physical aspect.
There is no one diagram though. You place your components and figure out where the wires need to go from there. If you understand the schematic then that should all fall into place. There is a certain level of stuff you need to understand before you buy $500 worth of parts. Helping someone that can't draw out their schematic is not something I personally would attempt.Typical Post: Hay guys, I bought $500 of parts today. Can anyone send me a diagram of how to wire.
Something that literally just teaches someone how to quickly wire a general circuit, since the wiring seems to be the biggest issue. I'm thinking we just need a RTFM primer.
So this says that 10awg should handle 30amps but all the 10 awg at my local stores say 20 amps, do I need to find 10 rated for 30 amp or will the 20 amp be ok
Btw I'll be just running the camco 5500w element and a pid, no pump
Thanks guys why not just over build it, better safe then sorry.
I do think there are also politics involved... A steel hinged control panel box cost about $5 to make but a nema certified steel hinged panel box costs $200 to buy... I'm all for additional safety measures as long is there is actual merit... Going with 8 gauge wire for a 30a circuit isnt any safer that 10 gauge of the same brand if its rated for 30a.. Why because extensive and expensive testing and certifications tell us that the 10gauge is perfectly safe and capable of passing that amount of current and the properly sized breakers help enforce that... If you don't believe that then you don't believe in those certifations or testing to begin with right?It's not so much politics as economics. Remember that the NEC was originally promulgated by the insurance industry and they are still in it big time. If the overall reliability of a NEC compliant electrical installation is 99.9% then the expected payout is $1,000 per million insured. If the insurers can arrange things so that people use practices that get them another 9 then the payout is only $100 and they can make appreciably more money for the same premium. In deciding what to do one computes his own expected values. As the pain of having the house burn down is to me much more than its insured value I'll go for a couple extra 9's if it is at all feasible to do so.
As politics seem to pervade everything these days I suppose that's true.I do think there are also politics involved...
Bob, is that you?A steel hinged control panel box cost about $5 to make but a nema certified steel hinged panel box costs $200 to buy...
Yes, actually it is. The 8 gauge has lower resistance per unit length, will thus, for any current, dissipate less heat and will, thus, in any cable, cable tray or conduit, experience less temperature rise. The probability of a fire will thus become lower and the expected costs may be lower. Now obviously you reach a point where the expected value of the loss is decreased for $0.01 to $ 0.001 and at that point you have over engineered (that would be my colleague Bill).Going with 8 gauge wire for a 30a circuit isnt any safer that 10 gauge of the same brand if its rated for 30a..
No, I don't believe that because it isn't true. Testing tells us that is is safe to 4 nines or 5 nines or something like that - I don't really know what the number is. This is far from perfectly safe. Despite the code electrical fires still happen. They represent very improbable events but very improbable events occur every day.Why because extensive and expensive testing and certifications tell us that the 10gauge is perfectly safe and capable of passing that amount of current and the properly sized breakers help enforce that... If you don't believe that then you don't believe in those certifations or testing to begin with right?
Electricians like to maximize profits just as the rest of us do. If an electrician thought he could convince the general contractor and the customer that he could decrease the expectational life cycle cost on a building by going to #8 instead of #10 he'd do it.And most of your professionally wired homes and building which are wired with the minimum sized wire code allows also back that point up..(contractors do not like to waste money).
If you want to go overboard that's cool, nothing wrong with that but to imply that someone is taking the chance of burning their house down by just meeting code and not using wire rated for higher amperage than they will pass through it is silly IMHO.
Hi,now I'm a student in New Zealand ,my master project is "electric brewery",using rockwell PLC.....can you give me some advises to choose the PLC and how to choose sensors?Thank you.
I would use the search option here and you will find threads with the answers you are looking for.
The InkBird ITC-308 is not a "servo" controller, but rather a simple on-off controller, using mechanical relays for controlling power. The combination of a 1375W element with this controller is totally unsuitable for fermentation temperature control. Also, when it is calling for power, the element will draw the full 1375W (if the line voltage is actually 120), and this is more than the rating of the output relays. This combination will almost certainly result in excessive temp overshoots in the fermenter, since you will overheat before the controller can detect the overheat (due to time delays, and temp gradients within the fermenting beer.)Extremely late to this game, but a great write up and I'm honing in on this statement in considering my new setup:
"Example: An element rated for 5500 Watts at 240 Volts used at 120 Volts has an actual Wattage rating of 1375 Watts. To determine the current draw, divide 1375 Watts/ 120 Volts = 11.46 Amps."
I have the same spec'ed (Dernord) element as above and will be using it to boil and a pinch hit "gentle" heating element during fermentation as necessary, since it will be in the vessel anyway.
I have a request for a sanity check here - by gentle I mean I do NOT need it to pull at 1375W while plugged into 120V, but since a heating element is a simple resistor in theory, if I'm not planning on any additional electronics other than a servo-type controller (i.e. InkBird 308 or similar) for fermentation, the fact that the mentioned controller can only drive 1100W, means that it's a no-go, correct? I'd need something rated for > 1375W right out of the gate less I trip the GFCI at the outlet due to the element trying to pull too much out of the 120V outlet...?
Thanks in advance for any informed advise!
I have a request for a sanity check here - by gentle I mean I do NOT need it to pull at 1375W while plugged into 120V, but since a heating element is a simple resistor in theory (in this case R = constant), if I'm not planning on any additional electronics other than a servo-type controller (i.e. InkBird 308 or similar) for fermentation, the fact that the mentioned controller can only drive 1100W, means that it's a no-go, correct? I'd need something rated for > 1375W right out of the gate less I trip the GFCI at the outlet due to the element trying to pull too much out of the 120V outlet...?
Thanks in advance for any informed advise!
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